DEEP STATE?

"Former Secretary of State Madeleine Albright describes herself as an 'optimist who worries a lot.' And lately, it seems, there has been much to worry about.". The article on NPR is worth reading. Fascism

Always considering myself an optimist, I'm shocked when some tell me I "worry too much". This mostly comes from my grown children. I've had this article in draft stage for a couple of months, as I thought maybe I am making much ado about nothing. When I read the above quote from Madeleine Albright this morning I knew I was not the only optimist who tends to worry. She has written a new book, Fascism: A Warning. Although she doesn't out and out call Trump a Fascist, she does say he is "the most anti-democratic leader that I have studied in American history."

As I am a big fan of Albright, I found myself justifying my own worries about the state of our country. I decided to go ahead and publish this post and then get back to bragging on all the good my children and grandchildren are up to in a future post. They are the ones who will be faced with undoing the damages made by the Trump administration.

***********************************

I have been hearing and reading many references to the "deep state"  recently. After running across a couple of definitions of the context currently being used, it reminded me of the 1960s, and the conservative conspiracy theory of "the Kingmakers", a behind-the-scenes group of powerful businessmen who were supposedly "really" running the country. 

Then I did some research into recent similar theories. Only this time, it was not proposed by radical conservatives. I found the following excerpt in an essay on Bill Moyer's website. Anatomy of Deep State It was written by Mike Lofgren in 2014, before Trump popped up in the political arena. I have substituted Obama's name with Trump .. 

Speaking of the authority possessed by the office of President, he writes:

"... President Trump can liquidate American citizens without due processes, detain prisoners indefinitely without charge, conduct dragnet surveillance on the American people without judicial warrant and engage in unprecedented - at least since the McCarthy era - witch hunts against federal employees (the so-called “Insider Threat Program”). Within the United States, this power is characterized by massive displays of intimidating force by militarized federal, state and local law enforcement. Abroad, President Trump can start wars at will and engage in virtually any other activity whatsoever without so much as a by-your-leave from Congress..." (by Mike Lofgren)

The above emphasis in italics is mine, of course. Add to the above the powers of the members of the so-called Deep State (who are really not so hidden)​, the "private enterprise" (read Mercer, Koch brothers, Sinclair Media, etc.) entities, to quote George W. Bush, "the deciders", and the direction the current Congress and Trump administration are leading us is akin to leading lemmings over the cliff!

(Kevin Kallaugher aka KAL)

Read the entire article if you want the bejeezus scared out of you. So much of what Lofgren wrote is similar to what is happening in Washington today.

Look at all the trouble the Trump administration has brought to us. See how he is dismantling and destroying so much of our country and its parks, institutions, safety regulations, civil liberties, etc., etc., etc.. 50+ years ago I thought we were in trouble with Communist Vietnam..​.now Trump has North Korea looming over us. He and his cohorts continue to deny critical climate changes, and we see some of the results in the horrific hurricanes of last year.

When Trump ordered troops be sent to the border of Mexico, he undoubtedly thought he could send in the Marines to show how tough he is. He is probably disappointed that the only ones he could send without the approval of Congress were the National Guard troops. And they are limited as to what they can legally do. Posse Comitatus Act

On February 23, 2018:

Trump touched on a wide-range of topics
during his CPAC speech. He called for Republicans to avoid complacency in the upcoming 2018 elections in order to keep both chambers of Congress in a march towards his own re-election in 2020. 

He also praised his work in improving the economy and claimed his administration had removed more regulations than any other in history.

And that's a good thing? Most regulations were imposed to protect the American people, not just the major corporations. Then there's the new tax plan that also favors the rich and corporations.

Now there are the "trade wars", which Trump avows we will "win". Poor farmers - just to begin with.

It is becoming increasingly harder to remain optimistic. The bright spots are some of the younger candidates moving up in the political realm. Ones like Beto O'Rourke challenging Ted Cruz here in Texas. We love the older politicians such as Biden and Sanders, however, they are well into their senior years. We need more young people, such as the brave high school students behind the Never Again gun control movement, deciding to go into politics in the future. We may someday again see democracy in action in our great country. I hope I am alive to see it.

I urge Democrats to avoid complacency in the upcoming 2018 elections.

(Wiki)

Peace,
Marilyn

FAMILY NEWS

Tanner went to Ecuador in January with students from UC Berkeley and some other college to work on an environmental engineering (his major) project involving bamboo. (They built a "house" from bamboo.) He is currently a freshman at the University of Texas. They were there for a week, and he made a couple of new friends who also attend UT. (After looking at a website for Ecuador, his mom said, "I want to go, too!" ) The last I heard, Tanner is planning to attend film school this summer, and work at a part-time job.

Hannah, a senior at Booker T. Washington Performing Arts High School in Dallas, will graduate this spring. She has been extremely busy recently interviewing at several different universities here in Texas, and recently she flew to Syracuse, NY to interview at Syracuse University. (They paid for her trip.) She had her interview, and according to her dad, Craig, it went well. He said she didn't sound too enthusiastic about the snow, however! Of course, we would prefer she go to one of the Texas universities, but like a lot of young teens, she is anxious to get far away from home. That is probably true for most college freshmen - at least until the first real case of homesickness sets in.

Hannah also recently directed a play at Booker T. Even though she aspires to be an attorney some day, Hannah is a talented playwright.. and apparently a talented director.

Ashlyn will graduate in May as well, from Oklahoma State University with a degree in Nutritional Science. She plans to spend the summer in Austin, working part-time, and studying for the GRE. (Graduate Record Examination. Created and administered by Educational Testing Service, it is used by thousands of graduate and business schools to make admission and fellowship decisions.) Currently, her plans are to go to graduate school to become a Physician Assistant (PA) as her mother did. We are hoping she applies to a PA school nearby. I've seen too little of this grandchild while she's attended OSU.

During winter break, Ashlyn went with her big sister, Audrey, and a friend to Big Bend, where they stayed in a rented cabin. Audrey took this amazing photo inside the cabin. I love this even more because Ashlyn is such a spiritual young woman.

This is Easter weekend. Daughter Carajean and her family are going to come over tomorrow after visiting an exhibition of Salvador Dali's paintings. I can think of a better artist to view on a Holy weekend. Although, hopefully, it will broaden the grandchildren's interest in famous artists and artwork. They are talented in the arts in many ways -- music, dance, photography, and film -- however, there are no artists in their family. Yet.

I've baked cookies, but I really miss dying Easter eggs for the kids to hunt! Time flies, and they grow up way too fast!

Craig, Carajean, Matthew
Easter 1972

Matthew's Children - Kelly and Travis

Easter 2011

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Happy Easter -- a day of overcoming! 

With love,

Marilyn

HOW MANY MORE MUST DIE?

My good friend and frequent contributor to not only this blog, but also to the Denton Record-Chronicle Letters to the Editor, Jack Garner, wrote the following shortly after the Texas church shooting last November. Since that time, according to the Gun Violence Archive there have been 1,894 gun deaths in the U.S. in 2018 alone. Number of mass shooting incidents reported and verified so far this year, 31. Number of teens (12-17) killed or injured, 373; and 70 children ages 0-11 killed or injured by guns. 

Those statistics alone should arouse the protective instincts of all Americans - not to go out and buy more guns, but to compel our Congress to strengthen the gun laws in this country. There should be no assault rifles sold to anyone other than our military or law enforcement. Why are "bump stocks" still being sold? We must strengthen our background checks. Why are guns being sold to anyone at gun shows without such checks? So many questions with only one answer - the NRA. Our children's lives are endangered more and more. Putting "good people" armed with guns at every school is ridiculous - and reprehensible.

After the shooting in Florida that cost the lives of 17 more children and their teachers on this past Valentine's Day I thought what Jack had to say last November was appropriate now as well. President Trump even made the very same comments.

NEW GUN LAWS NEEDED

John Nance Garner, V

"Donald Trump's unabashedly false declaration said, 'The Texas shooting is a result of a mental health problem; not United States gun laws.'

This proves his political relationship with the National Rifle Association and its ever-present mantra, 'Guns don't kill people; people kill people.'

Did Devin Patrick Kelly murder 26 people with a slingshot? Did Stephen Paddock kill 58 people and wound 546 others in Las Vegas with a cap pistol?

It's time to label NRA propaganda as what it is: Big bucks in the pockets of the gun industry. For over 50 years, the NRA has preached that the government wants to take away your guns. Not once has a government official knocked on my door and with outstretched hand declared, 'Gimme.'

How about you?

New laws should outlaw assault rifles like those that mowed down unsuspecting citizens in Sutherland Springs and Las Vegas. A new law should do away with clips holding 30 or more rounds of ammunition.

It would prohibit clips of more than 10 rounds for home defense. If you can't take down a home intruder with 10 shots, best you throw the gun at him and try to bite him to death.

Limited gun laws will not prevent deranged individuals from committing senseless killings; that is demonstrated by the death of eight people in New York City last week. (a 29-year-old man struck pedestrians and cyclists on a bike path around 3 p.m. and continued driving a rented pickup truck, colliding with a school bus.) But it will stop more Sutherland Springs and Las Vegas carnage. You can make it happen." 

         ************************************

"It takes a village to raise a child", but it only takes one person with a gun to kill him. And it takes a united country to stop the killing.

Peace and love,

Marilyn

                                                        

A TALENT EXPOSED by DEMONS FACED

This cute kid is all grown up now. He is Branch Tanner Archer, IV, and my middle grandson. To show my love and pride in him, I am dedicating this blog post to a recent paper he presented as an English assignment in his Freshman year at UT. I am pleased to report that he made an A on this. Of course, I told him I knew he would.

He explained to me that the assignment was "to write a 30 stanza poem about being a college freshman in terza rima, the rhyme scheme Dante used. It’s in iambic pentameter, 10 syllables per line, and an ABA - BCB - CDC rhyme scheme."

DEMONS FACED

(Photo: TIBOR KERCZ)

Yes, I, just hatched, had seen it all before,

Not once, but twice a sister left our nest.

“Be safe! Have fun! And call me I implore!”

Well time had passed with haste despite protest,
And I myself now faced the greatest flight.

Set back by hubris, I began my quest.

In hopes that you will learn from me I write.

Now midway through the journey of my year,

I find myself quite lost, not erudite,

And I have much to learn, and that is clear;

Yet turn your favored ear my dearest friend,

For you and I differ by just a year.

Just how I got there I can’t comprehend

The passing years so speedy and obscure

Without a guide, myself I had to fend

At last my first challenge I must endure:

I sat at lunch and looked around the room,

So many faces that I felt unsure.

“I can do this!” conceited, I assumed.

I took my plate and found a cordial face,

A small, humble friendship I hoped could bloom.

A second passed and then I knew my place.

Where I once hoped just for a kindly smile

A sickened face he made I can’t efface

Within my head and heart. This sting and trial

Was one that grew more challenging by day.

With this great fear I had to reconcile.

No volleyball had I, no cast away.

It was not range nor space that brought this Brute.

“To feel alone among a mass, to say,

can sting much worse, your happiness transmute.”

Who’s this, you say? A friendly bird I told

You of, the first to fly, one quite astute.

The Virgil to my Dante, I behold.

And what that bird gave me I can’t reflect,

Naïve in poetry. My strength threefold,

Empowered by friendship, I now connect

My fist to Loneliness, its wretched face.

With time I grew, with her I resurrect,

The happiness and grit I now embrace.

Short time had passed till I had fought again,

The second college struggle I would face.

A fight that is predictable, the stain

It leaves, a scholar’s pain. I had to make

A bitter choice. I weighed the scales for gain

 

Or loss in Chemistry, a test, a Snake.
The choice betwixt a concert of that band
I praise, or study and avoid the ache

and venom of that Snake, his poison gland.

As much as I would like to lie, you may

Have guessed I chose unwise. The day at hand

I dueled that snake, I lacked my tools. Now prey

Had I become, for sleep and time with books,

Vitalities I had forgone. To say

The least his bite had stung. The Snake unhooks

His fangs, and what remains, my shriveled pride,

For I mistook the Snake and judged by looks.

Once more I faced the hardened Snake and tried

To use my tools of sleep and books. Thank God!!

I fell the snake, but be aware and bide

By my advice. He waits for you, façade

Of death, to drop your tools and choose unwise.

The second challenge now complete, with laud

And glory I proceed. Now time that flies

Carries a better man to stronger foes.

Not long ago did these events grace eyes

Of mine. It was on break, the story goes,

When I had faced that third and final match.

A demon of the heart and home arose.

“On Thanksgiving his heart I shall dispatch!”

I disembark my plane; at home is where

He grows. A mother’s hug, a tighter latch

 

He has on those who weep. For every care

He makes you pay. For every friend, he slaps

Your face. “I miss my dogs, my room, this chair!”

Nostalgia floods your heart, now laced with traps,

Of memories now old and dear. Too soon

You shall be ripped away, a hell relapse.

In just a second I was back, the moon

Now held my gaze. How strange it is that I

Look on the same white face at home. “Attune

Yourself to suffering, but do not cry.”

My bird was back, my faithful guide. “This foe

Will fall when you have recognized goodbye.

This pain results from things once good, I know.
Appreciate those memories, let’s not
Forget. Now lift your head and have a go

At making more, you won’t regret.” I wrought

Myself as best I can. My tale ends here.

Good luck when you encounter those I fought.
...Branch Archer



He plays the cello and tennis as well.
This grandmother's heart swells at the thought of what he will accomplish in his life.

Peace and love.. and may all of your "demons" vanish this Christmas season.

Marilyn

HERE WE GO AGAIN

In light of the imminent vote on the latest GOP tax plan, I remembered a blog post from 2014 that brought on a case of deja vu. Even though we have changed presidents, so much still remains the same. One difference is that there are probably more congressional members who are now millionaires!

What do you think? Have we changed much since then?

"FULL-ON PLUTOCRACY"

You know for what I was most thankful this past Thanksgiving? That Trump at least hasn't caused a nuclear war. Yet.

Peace,

Marilyn 

SIMPLIFY

"Most of the luxuries and many of the so-called comforts of life are not only not indispensable, but positive hindrances to the elevation of mankind." — Thoreau

THE "BARN"

I have written many times about my many years living in a little two-room "barn" in the woods. It was a very simple, although sometimes labor-intensive, lifestyle compared to most of my other years. The first four years I cooked on a two-burner hotplate and a very small microwave oven. For some time I washed dishes in my bathtub. I know, yuck!  This did not deter me from having friends and family over. I'll never forget the day my sister Jean walked into the back room of the Barn and I heard her exclaim, "Oh! Goody, you have a kitchen sink!" (She always helped with the dishes when she visited.) Yes, I now could wash dishes without bending over my clawfoot bathtub. 

A few years down the road, someone donated an aging gas furnace, so I no longer had to depend on the small pot-belly woodburning stove and a kerosene heater for heat. As the house we were building at the front of our acreage was taking longer than we anticipated (and our love for one another was beginning to wane), I eventually had a secondhand washer and dryer installed as well as a gas stove to cook on. Many years down the road, my children gifted me with my first computer -- of course, I had dial-up internet service. Next came the time my son Matthew was frustrated at my old rotary dial telephone. He said I must be the only one in Texas to still use one. Of course, that meant I had to have a "push-button" telephone so he could check his messages on his new "cell" phone! (I'm not sure if that was the real purpose, as I can't figure out how that worked.)

Was I happier with a few more modern conveniences? No, although I was much happier without the husband when we split! 

"Too many activities, and people and things. Too many worthy activities, valuable things, and interesting people. For it is not merely the trivial which clutters our lives, but the important as well."--- Anne Morrow Lindbergh

I acquired more, and was gifted with more, adding to the family "treasures" I had to keep in a storage building. When I moved out of my wooded refuge, I began to feel the pangs of "too much stuff". My current home - which I vow to be my last one - is bursting at the seams with all of my accumulated stuff.

My son Matthew had nearly all of the Christmas decor I had saved through the years stored in a unit he had filled with his late father's items. The rental recently got so high ($200 a month!) that he insisted he had to bring my "stuff" to me to go through or he would take them to Goodwill. Aaarrgghh.. I suffered withdrawal pains at that thought. The stack of containers and boxes sat in my kitchen/living room area for two weeks until Carajean generously offered me two "workdays" to help with their disposal... (Oh, I hated that word.) These items had been stored for nearly 5 years, but they were valuable to me.

CJ helped me go through all of the containers. So much I forgot I had - or why I kept them. I mean, who needs twenty cookie cutters -- many of which are duplicates? Goodwill received a huge donation just in time for holiday shoppers. I no longer have room for a large tree.. and can no longer climb to put  garlands and lights around the room. There were too many sentimental items I had to keep though. Like the Wise Men my mother made.. the little stuffed teddy bear and rocking horse ornaments I made (my kids already have a plethora of things I made).. and of course, my Santa Claus collection! Believe it or not, we went through that mountain of boxes, tossed, gave away, and combined them enough that Carajean was able to fit them into my already full storage closet! Now, if I can only dig enough out of there to decorate this Christmas!

The second workday was probably just as hard on Carajean, as she worked on plants she brought me, potting and repotting, sweeping, and positioning everything "just so" on my front porch. Not only did she brighten a little corner of my world physically, but her company for those two days brightened my life spiritually and emotionally. There is nothing to compare with spending time with your adult children as you are growing older.

As we approach the holidays.. Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year, try to simplify your life by putting aside all of the "stuff" that takes up all of our time these days -- computers with high speed internet, cell phones, television and of course Netflix binge watching. Try doing less shopping, decorating, and party-throwing. Quality time spent with our loved ones is worth so much  more than all of the high-tech entertainment money can buy. You might just find that they are very interesting people.

And you don't need a cabin or barn in the woods to enjoy the simple life.

Peace and love,

Marilyn

ARMISTICE DAY aka VETERAN'S DAY

Today is Veteran's Day, and also my birthday. When I was growing up, it was called "Armistice Day". In my younger years, if it fell on a weekday, I thought I got to skip school just because it was my birthday. Holidays were acknowledged on the actual date back then. Boy! my age is showing.

The following post I published on my high school class blog in 2008. Since that time things have changed in my life. I've made two long distance moves, and most importantly, I also lost my Dad in 2015. 

I still remember the day he shared his stories with me on his 90th birthday, as we sat in that Long John Silver cafe. I got to see a side of my Dad he'd never shown me before. And heard stories he never told me before. 

I remember following him around in our back yard when the war was over and he returned home. Not really understanding war, I pestered him with questions. He told me about a little Japanese girl about my age who had to take care of her baby brother. She carried him around in a bag on her back. Curious, and just knowing enough about war and guns, I asked him if he ever shot a Japanese child. I was only about 7 years old at the time, and it frightened me when he got angry at that question, and told me to stop asking questions and leave him alone.

I don't believe Dad ever got over the things he witnessed during the war. Especially the times he spent in Okinawa and Japan.

********************************

J.F.Moragne (2nd from left) May 1952
San Antonio, TX

November 4th ~ Election Day ~ happened to be my dad's 90th birthday. I made the 3-hour drive to Mineral Wells to spend the day with him, and to reminisce about his 90 years on this earth. My daughter wanted me to take him to lunch on her credit card, so I asked where he would like to eat. Of all places, his favorite is Long John Silver in Weatherford. As we got settled into our booth to eat, we chit-chatted a bit. Toward dessert, I made the comment that I don't know how he keeps from being a butterball the way he eats anything he wants -- especially fried foods, and never gains weight. He informed me that he weighed the same now that he did when he was 18 years old and boxing for the Army. 137 pounds!

That started my questions. I knew he had some kind of title, but not what. It seems he was Lightweight Boxing Champ for his Regiment at Ft. Sam Houston. Somewhere in all my boxes of photos and memorabilia are some better pictures than what I have put on the blog this time, but these will suffice. Sorry, Dad. Wish I had planned this sooner. The pictures below were taken during his first tour of duty with the U.S. Army. He joined when he was only 17 years old. I'm not certain what the "uniform" on the left was for, surely it was not regulation! During this time, Dad said he weighed every morning. He couldn't afford to gain a pound. He did not want to be bumped into the Welterweight Division! Those guys were big! 

He finished that three year stint, then married my mother and they had me and my sister before the Big War, WWII.

 

1st Tour of Duty ~ Ft. Sam Houston ~ Regimental Lightweight Boxing Champ

One thing led to another, and I remembered photos like these below from World War II. I think I mentioned in another blog that Dad never really wanted to talk about his war experiences when we were young. I thought this was a good time to ask. I knew he was a paratrooper, but didn't know the whole story. Really funny incidents took place when he was sent to Ft. Meade, Maryland waiting for deployment to the South Pacific. To entertain the soldiers, they held boxing matches. The winner would get a 3-day pass. Well, Dad's experience when he was a young soldier champion boxer served him well. He said he kept winning matches. He would have weekends off, then add on the 3-day pass for five days in a row. When he returned, he boxed for the next couple of days, won again, and again. He said the whole time he was there all he did was box and take leave.

Although Dad's Unit never made a combat jump, after paratrooper training in New Guinea they made a jump onto Okinawa, where they did a cleanup action on the caves in the mountains. Looking for anti-aircraft guns. They were there when the atomic bombs were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki and the Japanese surrendered. His Unit was the second one sent into Japan for the Occupation.

  
With Occupation Forces ~ Japan 1945
First Sergeant Jarvis F. Moragne

At this point Dad was naming the villages they covered in the mountains. Good memory for 90 years old! I really wished I had had a tape recorder so I could get this straight. They sent patrols into the villages to destroy all the guns. As Dad was the oldest in his group of men, he was given the noncom rank of First Sergeant.   Dad started grinning as he remembered how the Japanese didn't show any respect at all for the military unless they were officers. Noncoms didn't count. In order to get the cooperation of the villagers, the sergeants like my dad were given lieutenant bars to wear. He said as soon as the Japanese spotted bars on his shoulders, they began to bow and nod in deference to his "rank".

As you can see from the pictures, it was snowing heavily at the time they were there. At one village they met with the villagers at the public school. The village officials adamantly denied they had any guns at all. However, tracks in the snow led Dad and his men to the huge anti-aircraft gun they had just moved to hide from the Americans. He still laughs about that. The Kamikaze glider pilots trained in these same mountains, so another one of Dad's duties there was to destroy any of the gliders still around. They also went into the schools and looked for books on aerodynamics and destroyed them, too.

Suddenly Dad looked at me and said, "You know there were concentration camps there, too." Yes, I knew, because as a young child I had seen lots of photographs in his scrapbook of piles of pitiful looking bodies as well as bones and skulls. There were mass graves being dug in these pictures. Dad said only one of the camps had American POWs, and the first Unit to go into Japan released them and they were already gone when Dad's Unit arrived. There were four more -- all containing Chinese and Koreans in terrible physical condition. (Images of the Holocaust came to mind.) I said that must have been horrible! He looked at me and said, "Yes, but we had a job to do." (They had to release the prisoners and bury bodies.) I said, "What a terrible thing to witness at such a young age".. He proudly said, "I was 26 years old!" At that moment, I knew it was that young 26-year-old man in charge of men in their teens that spoke to me. "But Dad, think about it. Your grandsons are all older than that! You were just a kid!" He lowered his head, and those frail shoulders began to shake. I think for the first time, in that near empty fast food restaurant, my father allowed himself to feel what he really must have gone through at that terrible time. He and I both shed silent tears for that young man, who was strong and courageous for the sake of the younger men under his command at the time.

(Below) Master Sergeant Jarvis F. Moragne ~ 4th Army HQ ~ Ft. Sam Houston, TX
Exercise Long Horn ~ 3 April 1952

Dad was called up to serve his country one more time during the Korean Conflict. A small Army Reserve Unit in Bronte, Texas got him to join them - really against his wishes. Naturally, they were the first to be called up when fighting broke out. This time he spent his tour of duty at 4th Army Headquarters in Ft. Sam Houston, Texas. Although most of his work was Top Secret, I did learn many years later that he was one of only three Master Sergeants that General Eisenhower recruited to be on his staff when SHAPE was formed in Europe in 1951. My mother threw such a fit because we couldn't join Dad for a year (I think it was in Paris), that he turned it down. Of course, it also meant he would have had to sign on for more years of duty. He was anxious by now (at 33) to start his own business.

I know you all could tell stories of your fathers' military service to our country, and many of you have your own stories to relate. Here's a salute to all of them and all of you! We honor you. We love the soldiers, but I think we all can agree, we hate the wars!

HAPPY 90TH BIRTHDAY, DADDY!

I'd like to close this with a quote I stole from my son Craig's blog:

"The United States of America is still run by its citizens. The government works for us. Rank imperialism and warmongering are not American traditions or values. We do not need to dominate the world. We want and need to work with other nations. We want to find solutions other than killing people. Not in our name, not with our money, not with our children's blood." ~ Molly Ivins

Nor our husbands' nor our fathers'..
Marilyn